10 Questions and Answers from Jonathan Robinson About MDMA and Psychedelics
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1. Why do you think there is a resurgence of interest in psychedelics and MDMA therapy at this time?
There are several reasons. First, these sacred medicines can deliver both deeply mystical experiences, as well as deep healing of trauma, anxiety, and depression. They really are profound. In fact, in recent years, hundreds of studies have shown just how effective various psychedelics can be for healing a variety of conditions. Second, books such as Michael Pollan’s “How to Change Your Mind” have introduced millions of folks to a more clear-eyed view of what psychedelics can do and how they work.
Finally, people are going through a hard time. Covid helped contribute to a mental health crisis that had long been simmering. Furthermore, the traditional ways of dealing with mental health challenges have not been very effective. For instance, studies show that anti-depressants are only 1% more effective than placebos for most people, whereas MDMA therapy has been shown to be 35 times more effective than that. Psychedelics are simply much more effective than what big pharma has sold to us as remedies for what ails us.
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Each of these medicines works in very different ways and are best used for different mental health challenges. For instance, studies show that psilocybin and Ketamine can be quite effective in helping people overcome depression, whereas MDMA has been shown to be extremely effective in helping people overcome trauma, addictions, couple’s issues, and loneliness.
Also, the time length of the effect of each of these substances, as well as the experience each of these medicines offers is very different. For example, psilocybin, LSD, and Ketamine can all lead to somewhat unpredictable “trips” filled with hallucinations and a sense of being out of control. On the other hand, the ingestion of MDMA in a therapeutic context virtually never leads to a bad trip, and there are no hallucinations that occur with this medicine.
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The Multidisciplinary Association of Psychedelic Studies (MAPS) wanted to show that MDMA can even work with folks with severe PTSD. In addition, they wanted to show that a simple pill could cure people without therapy. They have indeed shown that. On the other hand, I mostly work with people less disabled by their condition, and I like to do actual talk therapy while people are on the medicine.
Since I’m not seeking FDA approval, I can use what seems to work best—rather than what the government requires for a drug to be approved. In my work, I find that MDMA plus talk therapy can achieve in one day what would normally take two years of weekly therapy sessions to achieve.
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I’ve learned that everyone ultimately wants the same things: more inner peace, and more love and joy in their lives. Yet, people are often conditioned by their past and their culture to pursue these things in ways that are self-destructive or ineffective. Everyone has been traumatized by the challenges of their childhood and life, but MDMA therapy can quickly give people a new perspective and way to overcome their past obstacles. I’ve learned that when a person’s trauma is healed, and a vision of what’s possible is experienced, much forward movement can happen in a very short length of time.
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The most common reasons people come to me are for help in overcoming past trauma, seeking help in a relationship (couple’s work), and desiring more love and joy in their lives. MDMA therapy is amazingly effective for each of these issues if a client is properly guided. In addition, I can often help people learn how to tap into a feeling of love inside themselves when they are no longer on the drug. I call that “love training.”
I’ve found I can often help people in a single journey overcome problems that they have had for many years.
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I avoid legal problems by not doing anything that is actually illegal. When people contact me, I suggest they either get their own MDMA, or if that’s not possible, they contact someone I know over the app known as Signal—which is fully encrypted. Since I’m not involved in sourcing the medicine, I am not doing anything illegal. I am simply guiding clients in overcoming their challenges. When they come to me, the fact that they are on MDMA is not my legal responsibility.
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There are over 25 hours of teaching that I include in the course. I want the hundreds of folks I’ve trained to be well prepared for any challenges that can arise, as well as various therapeutic modalities to use during the sessions they guide. I even include such topics as how to get pure medicine, how to deal with side effects, and ways to market yourself in a legal manner. Participants also practice their skills under my supervision. For people interested in a much lengthier description, they can go to MDMAtraining.net.
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Amazingly, I get even better results when I do my sessions over Zoom than when I do them in my office. Of course, doing it over Zoom is very convenient, and people on MDMA prefer the comfort of their own home versus going to a stranger’s office. I think the results are better over Zoom because people feel safer in their own homes, and safety is an important factor in what makes this type of therapy so profound and effective.
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My parents had often wondered why I had spent so much time meditating. When I told them there’s a drug, MDMA, that can mimic what I’m after, I was surprised that they were interested in taking it. So, I gave them a couple of doses, along with instructions on how to take it. A year later, I asked them if they’d taken it and they said they had, but “it had no effect.” I found that strange, so I asked them what they did that evening and they reported, “Well, we ended up talking about how much we loved each other, and how wonderful our lives were, then we cuddled on the couch. It ended up being one of the greatest nights of our lives despite the fact that the drug didn’t work.” Of course, I laughed hysterically before revealing to them that their experience that night was due to the effect of the drug.
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When the FDA grants approval for physicians to prescribe MDMA—likely sometime in 2024, a lot more people will become interested in this therapy. Clinics that offer this therapy will pop up, but they’ll be very expensive. On the other hand, guided sessions like what I teach people to do will become much more prevalent and popular. Because the results are so dramatic, I think this type of therapy will become a major factor in helping millions of people overcome trauma, addiction, and depression, as well as quickly helping couples during challenging times.